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  #61  
Old 07-06-2018
HEMI_guy HEMI_guy is online now
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Professionals always take the high road and avoid being snarky regardless of any situation.

Good advice to anyone on NHRA's payroll when dealing with the general public, on or off the clock, would be to ask themselve's "What would Steve or Mac do?"

I have a very hard time envisioning either one of them ever being snarky or smug.

Last edited by HEMI_guy; 07-07-2018 at 07:59 AM.
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  #62  
Old 07-06-2018
Yvonne* Yvonne* is offline
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Originally Posted by coupe3w View Post
Yes Yvonne it is a parking lot and also parking on the left (non pit side) and more behind the hill a bit.
Thanks for the info! Just was curious....
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  #63  
Old 07-07-2018
a21stud a21stud is offline
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Originally Posted by Twostep View Post
I got lost clear back at first base....

Somebody explain to me why, at least in the short term until hopefully someone comes with a more permanent solution to save Pro Stock, is it wrong to bring in filler cars driven by retired/dormant or financially challenged racers in order to present a 16-car field? Who loses? Would the fans rather see 8 races with 2 cars each, even if a few of them are 2-3 tenths off the pace...or would they rather see 4 or 5 2-car races and a bunch of bye runs?

Would the regulars rather be making singles, or would they prefer to race somebody, even someone they know is slower?

Would the filler team rather be out there racing, knowing the odds are that Round 1 will send them to the trailer, or sitting at home watching Tony Pedregon call the 5 minutes of TV time allotted to Pro Stock on Sunday? Who cares, or why would they care, if Elite or Gray or KB provides a car and/or an engine to someone in order to ensure a full field? One of them calls me and my butt will be in Denver driving it, press release or no press release and I can't understand why in the world that would upset somebody.

I don't agree that filler cars are the ultimate answer and maybe I'm looking at this all wrong - but I look at it this way: if 5 starters for the New England Patriots were sidelined, would it be better to play the second stringers or just put 6 men on the field?
Your right, filler cars are better than short fields. Filler cars are better even when the filler cars are .4 off low ET. But having just enough filler cars to get to a 16 car field only means Sundayís 2nd round, semi finals and finals will be serious races. Fridays Q2 and Saturdays Q4 arenít nearly as important anymore as everyone entered knows they are in the Sunday show. The number 1 thru 4 qualifier know they have Sundayís first round won unless they have a major screw-up.

Filler cars and light fields are just a small part of the changes in Pro Stock over the last 3 decades.

Even a late as the mid 90ís, Pro Stocks were much more recognizable than today. If they were all painted white without stickers, you could still tell the difference between a Probe and a Cutlass or a Daytona and a Firebird. Scoop or no scoop, they all look alike today where it was obvious to the 1000í club folks which brand was pulling to the line in 1995. Thatís now gone and NHRA had to mandate the brand name be written on the windshield so spectators would know what car company the car is supposedly representing.

Back in the 1990ís Pontiac, Oldsmobile, Chevrolet, Ford and Dodges were entered at every race. Now Pro Stock is ďCamaro StockĒ. Yes, possibly two Dodges will show up at the bigger or closer to their home races and there might be one Ford at a couple of the 24 races.

Pro Stock used to be supported by many large national brands like: Valvoline, McDonalds, Motorcraft, Pennzoil, Summit, GM Performance, Superclean, Ford Quality Care, Chief Auto Parts, 7-11 and Winnebago. Spectators had choices. They could root for the driver, the car brand and/or the sponsor.

Also important, there was interest in Q4 as many were not going to beat the bump and the span from the number one qualifier to not qualifying was quite often .06 or less. During the 90ís there were plenty of drivers, car owners and crew that had stress related indigestion between Q3 and Q4 and there are very few with that problem today.

Thatís some of what I miss and donít see much of in todayís Pro Stock. The 2018 Pro Stock issues arenít that simple or they would have been fixed two years ago when the wheelie bar, scoop, car brand sticker and pit parking issues were addressed. I wish the fix was simple but it's not and yes, the passion of Mac4264. Comp670, Reinhart and others have me hoping they can figure out how to turn the decline around.
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  #64  
Old 07-07-2018
Twostep Twostep is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by a21stud View Post
Thatís some of what I miss and donít see much of in todayís Pro Stock. The 2018 Pro Stock issues arenít that simple or they would have been fixed two years ago when the wheelie bar, scoop, car brand sticker and pit parking issues were addressed. I wish the fix was simple but it's not and yes, the passion of Mac4264. Comp670, Reinhart and others have me hoping they can figure out how to turn the decline around.
Believe me, I couldn't agree more, including your take on filler cars as an interim patch job. But a patch is better than a hole. Indeed, I'd love to see at least 3 brands going at it with .05 or less separating 1 from 16....I grew up during PS's glory days, too.
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  #65  
Old 07-07-2018
JeffinNY JeffinNY is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Twostep View Post
I got lost clear back at first base....

Somebody explain to me why, at least in the short term until hopefully someone comes with a more permanent solution to save Pro Stock, is it wrong to bring in filler cars driven by retired/dormant or financially challenged racers in order to present a 16-car field? Who loses? Would the fans rather see 8 races with 2 cars each, even if a few of them are 2-3 tenths off the pace...or would they rather see 4 or 5 2-car races and a bunch of bye runs?

Would the regulars rather be making singles, or would they prefer to race somebody, even someone they know is slower?

Would the filler team rather be out there racing, knowing the odds are that Round 1 will send them to the trailer, or sitting at home watching Tony Pedregon call the 5 minutes of TV time allotted to Pro Stock on Sunday? Who cares, or why would they care, if Elite or Gray or KB provides a car and/or an engine to someone in order to ensure a full field? One of them calls me and my butt will be in Denver driving it, press release or no press release and I can't understand why in the world that would upset somebody.

I don't agree that filler cars are the ultimate answer and maybe I'm looking at this all wrong - but I look at it this way: if 5 starters for the New England Patriots were sidelined, would it be better to play the second stringers or just put 6 men on the field?
On a positive note, as of right now only .11 separates #1 Anderson's 6.51 from #14 Cuadro's 6.62. With today's expected conditions, I don't think anybody could beat that 6.51, but those in the low 6.60s might improve some.
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  #66  
Old 07-07-2018
Mac4264 Mac4264 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by a21stud View Post
Your right, filler cars are better than short fields. Filler cars are better even when the filler cars are .4 off low ET. But having just enough filler cars to get to a 16 car field only means Sundayís 2nd round, semi finals and finals will be serious races. Fridays Q2 and Saturdays Q4 arenít nearly as important anymore as everyone entered knows they are in the Sunday show. The number 1 thru 4 qualifier know they have Sundayís first round won unless they have a major screw-up.

Filler cars and light fields are just a small part of the changes in Pro Stock over the last 3 decades.

Even a late as the mid 90ís, Pro Stocks were much more recognizable than today. If they were all painted white without stickers, you could still tell the difference between a Probe and a Cutlass or a Daytona and a Firebird. Scoop or no scoop, they all look alike today where it was obvious to the 1000í club folks which brand was pulling to the line in 1995. Thatís now gone and NHRA had to mandate the brand name be written on the windshield so spectators would know what car company the car is supposedly representing.

Back in the 1990ís Pontiac, Oldsmobile, Chevrolet, Ford and Dodges were entered at every race. Now Pro Stock is ďCamaro StockĒ. Yes, possibly two Dodges will show up at the bigger or closer to their home races and there might be one Ford at a couple of the 24 races.

Pro Stock used to be supported by many large national brands like: Valvoline, McDonalds, Motorcraft, Pennzoil, Summit, GM Performance, Superclean, Ford Quality Care, Chief Auto Parts, 7-11 and Winnebago. Spectators had choices. They could root for the driver, the car brand and/or the sponsor.

Also important, there was interest in Q4 as many were not going to beat the bump and the span from the number one qualifier to not qualifying was quite often .06 or less. During the 90ís there were plenty of drivers, car owners and crew that had stress related indigestion between Q3 and Q4 and there are very few with that problem today.

Thatís some of what I miss and donít see much of in todayís Pro Stock. The 2018 Pro Stock issues arenít that simple or they would have been fixed two years ago when the wheelie bar, scoop, car brand sticker and pit parking issues were addressed. I wish the fix was simple but it's not and yes, the passion of Mac4264. Comp670, Reinhart and others have me hoping they can figure out how to turn the decline around.
I do agree with you on this. I have asked about doing a Cadillac ATS-v to try and help fill a void there which would like being a Oldsmobile or Pontiac replacement not much luck. Feel like one thing that cut pro stocks throat from the 90ís was that debacle of q3-q4 deal when there was 30+ cars. It should have been a 32 car field and first round ran on Saturday night instead of q4. We donít have that luxury now. I have stated the pro mod guys should do this as try and learn from pro stocks mistakes but thereís nothing wrong over there. Pro stock made same mistake and itís cost them now. Yes you stated there was lots of sponsor money available in those days too and itís not now. Which means itís down to this you throw money at the situation to try and prop it up or it dies off completely. Itís kind of like a company that needs to go into bankruptcy is it going to be 7 or 11.

To keep topic on track we sucked yesterday think we have been running a broke engine so changing motors this morning.
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  #67  
Old 07-07-2018
a21stud a21stud is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac4264 View Post
I do agree with you on this. I have asked about doing a Cadillac ATS-v to try and help fill a void there which would like being a Oldsmobile or Pontiac replacement not much luck. Feel like one thing that cut pro stocks throat from the 90ís was that debacle of q3-q4 deal when there was 30+ cars. It should have been a 32 car field and first round ran on Saturday night instead of q4. We donít have that luxury now. I have stated the pro mod guys should do this as try and learn from pro stocks mistakes but thereís nothing wrong over there. Pro stock made same mistake and itís cost them now. Yes you stated there was lots of sponsor money available in those days too and itís not now. Which means itís down to this you throw money at the situation to try and prop it up or it dies off completely. Itís kind of like a company that needs to go into bankruptcy is it going to be 7 or 11.

To keep topic on track we sucked yesterday think we have been running a broke engine so changing motors this morning.
Epping's Pro Stock after Q2: 15 Camaro's and 1 Dart in the 15th spot. Total of 16 cars. If Mexico's Fernando Cuadra didn't enter, who would they have gotten to enter the 16th car?

A lot of the ďCamaro StockĒ problem is that GM dumped Pontiac and Oldsmobile while keeping performance image weak Buick. (Yes, I knowÖ Buicks collectorís one claim to performance fame was when one magazine declared the Buick GS the fastest muscle car ever at the same time our government was shutting high HP sales down because we were going to run out of oil by 1984 if we didnít all go buy Civics, Vegas and Pintos. )

GM and Chrysler going broke really eliminated their niche marketing $$ for drag racing. That allowed Ford to follow suit since all the foreign companies were not spending money in drag racing. Itís my guess that Ford has now realized their performance car sales are coming from lower horsepower racing that more closely mirrors what they sell. Iím also assuming that the Tasca family history with the Ford higher ups is the only thing that is keeping money coming for Tascaís F/C hobby.

Pontiac and Oldsmobile had many wins and Pro Stock fans when GMís inept management team pulled the plug. NHRAís mistake was not digging into the problem promptly and approving Cadillac, Toyota, BMW, MB, Honda and (laughing is ok.) Volvo and Smart Car replacement specs. NASCAR saw the same issue in the 50-60ís and made sure replacements were available for Hudson, Nash, Studebaker and AMC when they tanked.

Mac4264, if NHRA had approved your desire to build a Cadillac ATS-V, the chances of Cadillac throwing some money your way should have been a sure thing. Too bad they didnít and good luck today... er I mean tomorrow.
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  #68  
Old 07-07-2018
Yvonne* Yvonne* is offline
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Originally Posted by Twostep View Post
I don't agree that filler cars are the ultimate answer and maybe I'm looking at this all wrong - but I look at it this way: if 5 starters for the New England Patriots were sidelined, would it be better to play the second stringers or just put 6 men on the field?
Filler cars are not the problem. Winning with an RT of .195 while your rental in the other lane coasts across the finish line after you is. Since you brought up the Patriots I would add that game suspensions were handed out because the evidence was "compelling" which means obvious. Force has had allegations of diving, some deserved too. We claim this is the professional level and yet there are no consequences for the obvious.

On another note: Good Luck today Chris!
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  #69  
Old 07-07-2018
Yvonne* Yvonne* is offline
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Clear and sunny there today!
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  #70  
Old 07-07-2018
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